What Bird Is That Forum

Any tips for keeping birds in flight in focus? My Sony RX-10 v4 is set for back-of-camera auto focus, if that makes any difference. Is auto focus of any use with BIFs or should I be working on my manual focus skills? I've long struggled with this, which is one reason I rarely try to shoot them. I have a cruise in a couple of months and I suspect few sea birds are going to perch on the boat for me!

Thanks.

No easy quick response for this so I'll just throw in some comments to get it started.
I'm guessing you mean "back button" focus which is the preferred method.
I took a very quick look at DPReview for your camera and the autofocus system seems to be quite highly rated, including people and animal settings (not birds) but I don't think they are important for bif.
I think the main thing is to limit the zoom, to say 500mm or 600mm equivalent, to keep the bird in the frame. I suspect bridge cameras are slower than SLRs to lock in on a subject, so patience to track the bird. You may be able to find a YT video with recommended settings, otherwise experiment with focus modes to find what works best for you.
I rarely use manual focus but sometimes have to - it helps if the focus ring is large and balanced with the camera. You could use the "prefocus" method - a small aperture (large f number) leaving the distance set at say 50ft so everything is in focus from maybe 25ft to 200ft (numbers are rough examples). Unfortunately the small aperture, less light, may hinder focus system.

Carnegie Hall is the short answer.

I think the main thing is to limit the zoom, to say 500mm or 600mm equivalent, to keep the bird in the frame.

600mm is my max zoom. When testing yesterday, I found 400mm was a good starting length to find and stay on a bird. Depending on how fast it was moving, sometimes I could zoom in without having to reestablish focus but I need to test that some more.

You may be able to find a YT video with recommended settings,

I've had a couple of recommendations of a .PDF on wildlife photography with this specific camera. I haven't had a chance to read it yet.

I rarely use manual focus ... Unfortunately the small aperture, less light, may hinder focus system.

Yeah, asking about manual was mostly to see if anyone was using that effectively. That notion died a quick, painless death. I'm working with f5.6 (although f8 has been suggested) and 1/2000 as starting points, adjusting exposure mostly with ISO as I shift between open sky and dark water as backgrounds.

Carnegie Hall is the short answer.

Our neighborhood has a fishing pier on a tidal estuary. Gulls, pelicans, wading birds, vultures, plenty of practice targets. I spent several minutes yesterday just tracking, without having my finger on the shutter button. Other than the hand positions, I didn’t find much different from my 10x42s. Indeed, some birds were easier because I could zoom out with the camera.

Thanks.

The focal point setup can make a big difference on how easily the camera tracks birds in flight. For your specific camera info, I went to Google and searched for, "Sony RX-10 v4 focal point options for birds in flight" and the Google AI suggested Wide Area AF, AF-C (continue focus), mid or high Continuous Shooting, and an assortment of setting suggestions and some other sound advice, some of which you're already doing. Included in the suggestions, which I suggest you Google yourself, there was a video from Stuart James that has camera setting suggestions that you might find helpful. I don't know of the photographer but what I saw made sense to me, as much as it can without having the camera in my hand. The video is 5 years old but that shouldn't matter.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X_9V7TsFHIs&t=14s

Wide Area AF, AF-C (continue focus), mid or high Continuous Shooting

Already there.

there was a video from Stuart James

I'm working from this document suggest by folks on two other forums. I find text much easier to learn from than video.
https://psnp.info/psnp_/wp-content/uplo ... 0iv-14.pdf

The video is 5 years old but that shouldn't matter.

Funny, so is the camera

Charlie Spencer wrote: Mon Jun 29, 2026 12:30 pm Any tips for keeping birds in flight in focus? My Sony RX-10 v4 is set for back-of-camera auto focus, if that makes any difference. Is auto focus of any use with BIFs or should I be working on my manual focus skills? I've long struggled with this, which is one reason I rarely try to shoot them. I have a cruise in a couple of months and I suspect few sea birds are going to perch on the boat for me!

Thanks.

One of the biggest challenges of bird photography, in flight or otherwise, is figuring out what went wrong when a photo doesn't turn out the way we wanted. If the focus is off, it could be blurry from too slow a shutter speed, or it could be the focus locked on the closest wing tip and left the rest of the body and head not quite as sharp because of the shallower depth of field that comes with a wide open aperture, or an array of other possibilities. Learning how to interpret our photos is key to improving on them. Although I've never used them, some photo viewing/editing software will show you where the focal point was when the shutter activated, which might be helpful in determining if you just missed the mark or if something else is going wrong. Being zoomed closer to the birds makes them harder to track and not being zoomed close enough makes it harder to catch the details and easier for the focus to jump to something else in the frame. I hate to say it but you're opening a door to photography that requires you to take a lot of photos and analyze them closely if you ever want to get across the threshold.

One questions to ask yourself regarding focus is, is the entire bird out of focus or are there varying degrees of focus sharpness?
If the entire bird is out of focus, the focus may have jumped to something in the background or motion blur might indicate that you may need a faster shutter speed. If there are various degrees of sharpness you might need a smaller aperture for more depth of field. Sometimes it's simple to see where improvement can be found, other times you might have to look harder but the indicators of what changes to make are usually hidden in each photo, if you can find them, which isn't always a given.

After going through my BIF photos on the first page of my Flickr account, https://www.flickr.com/photos/182354370@N02/ I noticed that my best flight shots include shutter speeds of 1/2500-1/3200 and aperture settings from wide open F7.1 right up to F11 with my favourites at F9 and F10. I have a Yellow-rumped Warbler with blurred wingtips at 1/2500 shutter speed, which suits the photo but shows that the shutter speed could have been faster. I have a mediocre Bald Eagle and Red-tailed Hawk photo taken at F11 where the focus is a little softer on the hawk showing that an even smaller aperture might have made a better photo.

Because of the endless variables, there are no magic numbers for BIF photos so I will offer this advice. Use as fast a shutter speed as possible to freeze the wings in motion and use as small an aperture as possible for extra depth of field. I suggest pushing both shutter speed and aperture further and further until Auto ISO reaches your preferred limit and then dial shutter speed and/or aperture back if/as needed. When deciding what adjustments to make, I would open my aperture for extra light before I would slow down my shutter speed.

Good luck

Lonestranger wrote: Wed Jul 01, 2026 4:23 pm I hate to say it but you're opening a door to photography that requires you to take a lot of photos and analyze them closely if you ever want to get across the threshold.

My original post was copied and pasted across three other sites. Two were birding sites, and the last was in the Wildlife section of a photography site. For that last one, I added a caveat that didn't appear on the birding site posts. Maybe I should have included it on the birding forum posts too.

My goal is to get practical shots good enough for identification purposes, not necessarily artistic.

I include that when I post on photography sites because folks there default to trying to get the best possible shot. I'm usually aiming for 'Good enough!'.

Yeah, I expect to burn through some battery recharges and spend time tossing 95% of the shots in the trash. So far, the feedback I've received across the four sites has enabled me to do a much better job in the last two days than I expected. I freely admit most of the improvement was due to being reminded this camera has a continuous focus capability, something I hadn't used on my previous BIF attempts. The tool does a better job when you use the correct settings!

Some notes after five hours of testing and 900+ images over two days.

• I am not having any problem staying on a bird for ten seconds, sometimes longer.

• The images I'm getting are stay in focus through a burst series as the bird changes distance. That's at 3 frames per second over ten seconds or more. That's ASSUMING I had the camera correctly focused at the start of a run (more on that below). But even when the focus is off on the first photo, the images remain unfocused to the same extent throughout the burst series. The focus stays locked as the background shifts from sky, to structures on shore, to water, sometimes even when an intervening object briefly blocks the line of sight. I lose focus as the birds approach too close and the changing rate of approach accelerates, but I assume that's normal.

• Regarding not getting proper focus for the first shot, I may go back to smaller focus area. With a large focus area, autofocus seems has problems picking up smaller or more distant birds against ocean and sky. My next round of practice will experiment with how the various focus area options handle light birds in the sky or dark ones against water. A wider focus area does work well with flocks or if other birds enter frame.

• I may also go back to single shot instead of burst. 3 fps is generating so many images that I am intimidated by the task of wading through them. It's also harder to stay on a bird when using burst, since the screen briefly flickers after each shot. Finally, using burst eats through batteries like a vulture in a slaughter house. Admittedly, because I was experimenting, I was probably holding the shutter button a lot longer in practice than I will in reality.

So my initial tests and practice session are accomplishing my primary goal of getting clearly identifiable images. Of course, identifying the photographed birds is easier when they're familiar local species! As to settings, I suspect I'll store two sets for BIFs in the camera's memory. Both will have many settings in common but one will be narrow focus area and single shot per shutter button push, while the other will be wide area focus and 3 fps.

Thanks for all the advice and feedback so far!

Charlie Spencer wrote: Thu Jul 02, 2026 6:01 pm Regarding not getting proper focus for the first shot, I may go back to smaller focus area.

If I'm not mistaken, the video I posted focuses on how to set up your camera so you can switch between different sized focal areas for different situations with just the push of a button. He mentions it right at the beginning of the video and then about 5 minutes into the 10 minute clip he shows the back of the camera as he walks you through the menu with specific steps to get the intended settings.

As far as the volume of photos in burst mode goes, have you considered using a faster frames per second setting and shorter bursts. Pausing between bursts allows you to control how many photos you accumulate and how quickly your battery drains(?). My logic is the more frames packed into the shortest time span, the more likely we are to catch that quick flash of colour or occasionally seen marker when/if it's revealed. It's amazing how fast things can change in under a second and a quick frame rate helps ensure we capture all those changes.

Not that it matters but I usually press the shutter button for 5-10 frames(not seconds) in high speed burst mode, lather, rinse, and repeat as needed. I will occasionally hold the shutter button down for more than few seconds at a time, but it's very rare for me to do more than a quick touch and release in burst mode, and then another short burst, etc.

Glad to hear that you're improving and getting closer to the results you're looking for. I am also glad that you are listening to the advice being offered and using it, or not using it, to become the kind of photographer that you want to be.

If I'm not mistaken, the video I posted focuses on how to set up your camera so you can switch between different sized focal areas for different situations with just the push of a button.

I'll (try to) take a look. I say 'try to' because I really dislike trying to learn from videos. Either the pace is too slow, or I can't effectively control replaying the content I want, or there's too much content I'm not interested in, or (worst of all) ads I can't forward through. Thanks for including time stamps; that will make it easier.

have you considered using a faster frames per second setting and shorter bursts. ... My logic is the more frames packed into the shortest time span, the more likely we are to catch that quick flash of colour or occasionally seen marker when/if it's revealed.

Funny, my logic has been that the longer between shots, the more likely the bird will change orientation and show me a different view of it.

I usually press the shutter button for 5-10 frames(not seconds) in high speed burst mode, lather, rinse, and repeat as needed.

Right now I'm holding for ridiculously long bursts of 10 and 15 seconds, but that's because I'm practicing tracking at the same time. I've attempted burst only rarely in the past and not for years. Learning how to manage it is unexpectedly becoming the most challenging issue I've encountered in this project! I'm either reflexively triggering the shutter as if I was in my usual single-shot mode (pressing and releasing the button repeatedly) or I'm leaning on it like there's no tomorrow while trying to stay on the bird. I'll see if I can train myself to shorter burst with a few seconds in between.

I have three batteries but I don't know if I'll be able to recharge them in short order on the ship.

Glad to hear that you're improving and getting closer to the results you're looking for.

Yeah, that's the key point!

A few other things to consider when comparing what settings work best.

Lighting can influence a photo as much as settings. The best lit subjects are usually the easiest to get good focus on.

The direction of the bird's flight can influence how well your focus tracking works. Birds flying towards or away from the camera are constantly moving out of the focal plane making focusing more challenging for the camera.

Birds flying across the horizon are less challenging because they stay closer to a constant focal plane.

Birds flying directly overhead will also focus differently.

My point is to consider the circumstances of each shot when looking for what worked best. This is where the analyzing your photos closely part that I mentioned earlier comes into play. Knowing your camera focuses better on birds fly from side to side than on birds flying straight at the camera may help you figure out why some conditions don't produce as many in focus shots. Lighting, camera settings, and bird co-operation all affect our focus and image quality, don't forget to consider the other factors when evaluating what settings you used.

Just a few random thoughts that are probably more of a distraction for me than any real advice for you.

Charlie Spencer wrote: Fri Jul 03, 2026 11:03 am I have three batteries but I don't know if I'll be able to recharge them in short order on the ship.

We have a couple of battery packs of different ratings, the size of a phone or smaller, that we got for charging our phones in emergencies but are most often used for convenience. Perhaps a small power bank suitably rated to recharge your battery right in the camera in case of emergency might be worth looking into. It's not much different than a fourth battery, but I think three batteries should be plenty so the battery pack would be more for peace of mind than anything else. I have no idea if it's possible or practical but I thought I'd throw it out there anyways.

Charlie Spencer wrote: Fri Jul 03, 2026 11:03 am Funny, my logic has been that the longer between shots, the more likely the bird will change orientation and show me a different view of it.

Tough choice here, miss the critical shot because the frame rate is too slow or miss the critical shot because of a pause in a faster frame rate?

Charlie Spencer wrote: Wed Jul 01, 2026 5:14 pm My goal is to get practical shots good enough for identification purposes, not necessarily artistic.
I include that when I post on photography sites because folks there default to trying to get the best possible shot. I'm usually aiming for 'Good enough

Aiming for the best possible shot doesn't mean all our photos will be good enough, but it does increase our chances.

Don't forget, there is a bird in flight thread where you can share some of your practice shots.

Lonestranger wrote: Thu Jul 09, 2026 2:13 am Just a few random thoughts that are probably more of a distraction for me than any real advice for you.

Charlie Spencer wrote: Fri Jul 03, 2026 11:03 am Funny, my logic has been that the longer between shots, the more likely the bird will change orientation and show me a different view of it.

Tough choice here, miss the critical shot because the frame rate is too slow or miss the critical shot because of a pause in a faster frame rate?

This point was driven by my initial dislike of 3fps burst generating more shots than I wanted to wade through. My approach to dealing with the overload was to reject burst for BIFs and set the shutter button for single shot. Then I got my head out of my cloaca and realized I can set the button for burst for BIFS so it's available if I want it, but just press and release the button for a single shot instead of holding it down! My mother raised an complete idiot.

Lonestranger wrote: Thu Jul 09, 2026 2:13 am Aiming for the best possible shot doesn't mean all our photos will be good enough, but it does increase our chances.

I'll try for the best possible but my level of 'Acceptable' is much lower than most participants on photography forums. See my previous statement about emphasizing my goals when I'm on one.

Lonestranger wrote: Thu Jul 09, 2026 2:13 am Don't forget, there is a bird in flight thread where you can share some of your practice shots.

Actually, I had completely forgotten! Hopefully I'll get some results up today. Really, the biggest difference has been various reminders that the camera has continuous focus. I worked with that a couple of times in the last couple of weeks at spots close to the house, switching between Auto focus for perched birds, and continuous for BIFs. Then yesterday I went an hour south to a favorite hot spot, a tidal estuary great for waders, shorbs, osprey, and gulls, lots of aerial activity, my arrival timed for two hours before low tide. ... and completely forgot to switch the focus mode to Continuous for BIFs. Shot the whole day in Auto. Unsurprisingly, only the first shot of each flying bird was in focus.

Charlie Spencer wrote: Thu Jul 09, 2026 10:11 am I'll try for the best possible but my level of 'Acceptable' is much lower than most participants on photography forums

Believe it or not, my level of 'Acceptable' is also lower than many photographers. I am far less concerned about noise in my images than most photographers, which is why I use higher ISO settings for faster shutter speeds. My hope has always been to get unusual captures of birds in action, and that usually requires fast shutter speeds. I'd rather introduce noise with the higher ISO than deal with motion blur due to a slower shutter. I'm not after perfect images, but I do like getting the best quality I can get.

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Charlie Spencer wrote: Thu Jul 09, 2026 10:11 am My mother raised an complete idiot.

No reason to blame your mother when you can take full credit for that yourself.

Lonestranger wrote: Thu Jul 09, 2026 11:21 am No reason to blame your mother when you can take full credit for that yourself.

Yeah, I got nothing. Your point.

Today's interesting discovery - the same techniques and settings used for BIFs are also effective when the bird is stationary but the photography platform is unsteady. I took a ferry ride this morning and the water was a bit choppy. I was able to get some mediocre but identifiable shots of osprey perched on channel markers. Nothing worth posting but the images weren't blurred by the boat's motion.

These are from the local ferry. Even more than my attempts from a local pier a couple of weeks ago, this is as close as I can come to the conditions I expect on the cruise ship in August. Moving boat, far more birds around than I expect in the middle of the Atlantic, other passengers moving around.

I'm quite satisfied with these, especially the gulls.

https://ebird.org/checklist/S374144980